Interview with Natalie Barr, Sunrise

11 September 2024

NATALIE BARR: A landmark report has called for State and Federal Governments to stop spending money on infrastructure in order to free up the construction industry and build more homes. The report suggests that massive infrastructure projects such as the Sydney Metro or Melbourne's North East Link, as well as general plans for schools and hospitals, would need to go on the back burner to meet current housing targets. It comes as federal Labor falls behind on their pledge to deliver 1 million new homes. For their take, let's bring in Housing Minister Clare O'Neil and Shadow Finance Minister Jane Hume. Good morning to both of you. So, Clare, if the government is worried about a tradie shortage, why don't you look at telling the states to direct some of the tradies off these big projects, put them on hold for a while like this report suggests, and onto housing plans?

CLARE O’NEIL: Yeah, well firstly Nat, I think all your viewers at home know that we've got a chronic housing shortage in our country. That's been really the result of decades of governments and industry failing to invest in the housing needs of Australians. So you mentioned off the top there that our government is the first in many decades to really come into this and say the Commonwealth is going to work with the States to try to address this problem by building more homes. Now, that is going to be really challenging. We've got bold and ambitious targets, but we're not going to get anywhere in this really difficult problem unless we be bold and ambitious. The report talks about the fact that a lot of the State Governments are facing this really similar mix of problems, which is they've come into office, not enough spending on infrastructure, not enough spending on housing, and we haven't had the investment in skills that we've needed to support all the work that needs to be done. So this is something where we're working really hard on at the moment. Some of your viewers at home would remember that we've invested in 500,000 fee-free TAFE places, and then we're adding another 300,000 to that. Lots of those young people will be trained in construction trades we desperately need.

NATALIE BARR: Which is fantastic, but as we know, it takes a while to become a tradie, you know, several years. So in the meantime, is it a good idea? Like this guy suggests, putting some of these big infrastructure projects on hold and getting some of the tradies onto houses. What do you think?

CLARE O’NEIL: Look, I don't think the answer is slowing down much needed infrastructure in our states and ultimately the State Governments do need to balance this complex kind of demand for housing with infrastructure. What I would say is that we need to invest in the capacity of our construction sector, and we've got to support these amazing tradies around the country, who are going to build all the homes that we need to get us out of the crisis and that's the big focus for us, building those skills, investing that you've seen us do that really consistently over two years and that is going to have an impact on this problem.

NATALIE BARR: So what about now though? Like right now?

CLARE O’NEIL: Well, now we need to make sure that we're building more homes across the country.

NATALIE BARR: And how do we do that?

CLARE O’NEIL: And that's something that I've been talking about with my state colleagues. Some of the things that we need to do, we need to really strongly invest in skills. Some of it will probably involve making sure that we're using the migration system properly, which is bringing in those skills that we desperately need but we're also putting more money into housing and that's something that's very different between the approach you see from the Albanese Government and Jane and her colleagues, who say that in the middle of a housing crisis, they are going to cut billions of dollars of funding for much needed social and affordable housing. So we're trying to tackle the problem from every angle, build more homes, support renters who are really doing it tough at the moment, and make sure that we help more first home buyers into the market. It's a very comprehensive approach and people may criticise our Government for many things. We have stepped into this housing problem in a really big way and I think that deserves to be acknowledged.

NATALIE BARR: Jane, Clare is right. This did not happen in just two years. So what would you do?

JANE HUME: Yes, Clare's right to a point. Getting the balance right between infrastructure and housing is important, and bringing in those skilled migrants is fundamentally important, something that Labor have resisted for years, bringing in skilled migrants with the right trades that we need. But the report that you're referring to Nat, also pointed to a few other things. Getting zoning and planning reforms right as well, working with the states directly to do that, and of course, lowering interest rates because as interest rates stay higher for longer, people retreat away from the housing market. That's something that we've heard in my Cost of Living Committee and it's also something that's in this report. Under the former Coalition Government, there were, in fact record levels of both approvals and completions of housing. But unfortunately, the way we've seen that, the way things have panned out in the last two years is that the market has dried up. Things need to change, they need to change quickly. The Government keeps crowing about how much money it's putting into this, but how many new houses have actually been built and turned the key in the last two years? Simply not enough.

NATALIE BARR: Clare, are you going to revise your estimate? Because I think you want, you've said 1.2 million by 2029. There are 160,000 new housing commencements last financial year. That's supposed to be 240 a year? I think you're aiming for 180 next year, it's way behind.

CLARE O’NEIL: Yeah, well, I don't think the answer here, Nat, is for us all to lower our ambitions. That's how we got to where we are today. When we look at what's happened to housing in our country, effectively for more than 25 years, housing has gotten much more expensive, and governments around the country just haven't invested enough and rolled up their sleeves and done much about this problem and that is changing with the Albanese Government, unsurprisingly, because your viewers will know that our Prime Minister, his entire life was changed by his access to affordable housing in his childhood. So we've got a really big, ambitious plan here, but I don't think anyone expects that our government is going to be able to fix what is a 25 year old problem in our country, in the first two years in office. We're making big strides, we've got bold ambitions, we've got big, we've got bold ambitions here and what I really wish is that instead of all the sort of grizzling that goes on from other parties, that they'd come in and help us with this. Nat, we've got two bills that are stuck in the Senate at the moment.

JANE HUME: You’ve got wall to wall Labor Governments, how much help do you need?

CLARE O’NEIL: Please don't interrupt, Jane. We've got two bills in the Senate at the moment that Jane and her colleagues and the Australian Greens are stopping us from moving forward. Bills that will build more housing and help more first home owners into the market, but they're standing in the path of this to play politics and my view is we've got to put politics to the side. This is a crisis, and we need the political parties to work together on solutions.

NATALIE BARR: Yeah, well, you're right on that. It is a crisis and it’s been a long time coming and we do need to sort it out. We'll leave it there. Thank you. See you next week.

JANE HUME: Thanks, Nat.